Rouvy Blog | Introduction of Multi-Lap and Group Ride in Limited Beta Mode

louishamel - 25.02.2021

Q1: Is drafting enabled in the group rides?

Q2: Are other non-group riders visible on the course? I don't mind if they are. I guess that drafting would not be enabled for them since their ride might count towards a challenge or career level.

paulalexjackson - 18.02.2021

Do official Rouvy Group Rides count towards "race count" on challenges? Specifically, at the Regional Class level I need to do 3 races. If I do the "L'Etape Czech Republic - Group ride 1" this Sunday at 12pm will it count towards the challenge?

LukasToth - 19.02.2021

Hi, no, only TSS are counted towards the career or challenges in the case of Group rides.
- paulalexjackson - 19.02.2021
  
  Gotcha. Thanks Lukas. For clarity, TSS is just the “points”, correct?
  - LukasToth - 19.02.2021
    
    Yes, exactly. :)

Artur_Kubinski - 17.02.2021

Only when will there be a chat? By writing on the phone? Group driving without talking is boring.

simonakrivankova - 26.02.2021

Hi, you can use free Discord application to talk - not bad (I had Rouvy on PC and Discord in Mobile) :)
ROUVY - 19.02.2021

Hello Artur,
chat will be added but we don't know when exactly.
Thank you for your understanding.

arnostlobel - 17.02.2021

It looks to me that Rouvy group rides have been designed to work pretty much exactly like Zwift group rides, sans the different terminology. If it is indeed so, I must express my mild disappointment. I tried a group ride on Zwift once and concluded it sucked. For me anyway. I ended up pulling an entire group of riders who enjoyed a nice chat among themselves while putting about only 50% of my effort. I have wished for a long time Rouvy had group rides but I truly hopped Rouvy would come up with something better.

My vision of an effective group ride is that participants would get “equalized” based on their respective FTP and weight, assuming their settings reflect their true measurements as closely as possible. The resulting effect of equalizing would be that if all members of the group would ride at 100% of their FTP they would all have the same speed regardless of the route’s profile; no magnet needed. That way all members could stays together regardless of their current abilities, providing they all give it the same effort. Those giving it less than others would obviously get dropped (unless the group slowed down), but that is like on a real group ride, isn’t it? My current problem on Rouvy rides with my buddies is that we are not equal at our abilities. The differences between the strongest and the weakest of us is about 40%. We try to “pseudo-equalize” it by adjusting our reality settings, but that is not very granular. We can also fine-tune it by modifying our weight, but that is not ideal either, for what would work well on a hill will naturally not work on a flat terrain.

Anyhow, I hoped that Rouvy would invent a feature that would let my group enjoy riding together regardless of our actual abilities. But we never wanted to be forced to stay together by a magnet. We all want to work equally hard or equally easily.

louishamel - 25.02.2021

So to sum it up, you want the members of the group to ride together, but only so long as they are riding at the same percentage of their FTP. Rouvy's current implementation doesn't stop everyone from riding at the same % of FTP, but it doesn't enforce it either. I'm sure that you're aware of the drawbacks of your suggestion (not knowing your FTP in the first place, varying ability levels, you're on an off day, etc). The solution for you may be to advertise the watts/kg target of the group ride. For example, "2.8 w/kg pace". That way riders will know more or less watt to expect. If it turns out that they are over-stretched, they can recoup while someone else is on the front, and when they're feeling better they can take a turn.

The main purpose of the group ride is to allow riders of differing abilities to ride together. Out there on the road, the stronger riders may be doing the lion's share of the pulling, but they also have the option of slowing down and letting someone else take a turn.

For my wife, an e-bike has been the great equalizer outdoors. In fact, she cleans my clock any time the road goes up. Indoors, she loves the Rouvy videos, but no way would she be able to do any of the longer cols in a reasonable amount of time on the trainer. But she'd be more than happy to go at her own pace and let me tractor her up the slopes of the Stelvio. So the current Rouvy implementation seems to fit my use-case. The only features I see are lacking are the group pee breaks (3 hour ride, 10 people in the group, and no one needs to pee? C'mon, where's the realism in that?) and the ability to transfer the group leader role to someone else when the leader gets called for dinner or loses the connection.
- arnostlobel - 26.02.2021
  
  Everybody’s different, I get it. The group feature as it is will surely work for some. It won’t work for me. I have no interest riding in a game-like mode. If I wanted such an experience I’d ride on Zwift. I’ve chosen Rouvy because it is as close to real riding as it gets. During a real group ride there is no way people will get glued together as if with some magnet. It’s either I ride at approximately the same effort like everybody else, or I get dropped. That is the case even on no-drop rides. It usually sorts out quite naturally, in fact. Big groups always separate themselves to smaller bunches based on riders’ abilities (or their willingness). After that the now smaller groups, say five to ten riders, tend to stick together and become a de facto no-drop ride, but at the same time everyone in those small groups is making pretty much the same effort. And that is what I wish I had on a virtual group rides too. I have no desire to be within a virtual group ride with hundreds of other virtual riders whom I do not know and to whom I would be tied with a magnetic spell. Of course, like I said, everybody’s different with different needs and different expectations. I am only voicing what would work for me, which is an option to create a handicapped group ride in which my buddies would be more or less equalized based on their weight and FTP (as close a guess as possible), so we could all go for a ride together despite of our respective abilities. We would not be pulling or pushing anyone with us – those who do not want to ride at the agreed upon effort would have to finish on their own.
shaft120 - 18.02.2021

Agree with this feature being useful. However it's more of a handicap function rather than a Group ride. I would like to see more drafting / peleton functionality and as you describe a handicap function which allows people of different abilities to ride together and race on equal footing. This would be a very motivating feature. It would also allow me to ride with my family for example...
Artur_Kubinski - 17.02.2021

Your logic is not clear. If you want everyone to ftp100%, how do you keep him in the group? How do you get 60% of eaters to ftp100% and why 100% and not 50%? The group is as a result of group riding. The group goes slowly, everyone turns slower. A group ride is perfectly fine on zwift. It is with and without the snap option.
- arnostlobel - 17.02.2021
  
  The logic is sound, I only didn't explain it clearly, I suppose. I would not require the group rides at 100% FTP. The group decides what the ride will be like - an easy ride, a hard ride, or anything in between. I used 100% effort as an example, but I could have used 50% just as well. Say the group decides on a very easy ride, about 65% of everyone's FTP. Then, assuming everyone in the group puts in his or her 65% (of FTP) effort, the group will stay together, because everyone speed would be equal. I do not want to force anyone to stay in the group. If someone rides at, say 50% (using the same example), they will naturally drop behind. Conversely, of someone else decides to go harder after all, they will obviously ride away from the group. Their decision. All I want is to have a group in which each rider is sort of guaranteed to be able to stay with the group, providing - AND THAT IS THE KEY DETAIL - that they put in the same effort. It's the same like on a real group ride. You have to put in basically the same effort if you want to stay with the group. You may make it easier for yourself by not pulling so much or not so often at the front, or not pulling at al, but no one is allowed to really slack - the only options are a) the slacker puts in more effort, or b) everyone in the group easies up.
  - Artur_Kubinski - 17.02.2021
    
    If the road is uniform, it is easy to implement. The problem starts with the mountain road, the descents. The lightweight one will give less watts and run away from the group. Drive exit has no brake here. The heavier person will run outside, I have to pedal. Maintaining an ftp group isn't good either, because who will be a role model? LEADER?
    
    arnostlobel - 17.02.2021
    
    That is correct, Artur. On flat terrains or a road with a constant gradient it is relatively easy to equalize the field. I'll do that regularly for my group of riders. As a group leader I calculate everyone's reality settings and their weights to come up with numbers that would make as pretty much even. That way we can finish still together, give or take a few meters. Doing so on an uneven terrain is nearly impossible. I can average the calculations based on the overall profile, but we typically cannot stay together regardless of our even effort.
    The responsibility for the expected effort is not as hard as you think. I am not talking about group rides of 500+ people (like some races on Rouvy) - that is just plain crazy. I am talking about a bunch of people getting together and riding at an agreed upon effort; say, hard Tuesdays, tempo Thursdays, recovery Fridays, long endurance Saturdays or Sundays. I do that normally in the real world, of course. The difference is that in the real world I have to group-ride with people who match my fitness. In the virtual world of Rouvy, a matched fitness does no longer need to be a limitation. I could get together (and I do) with my friends who are less experienced/capable than I and we could still enjoy an almost natural group riding; if only Rouvy could equalize us dynamically.
    
    Medzamir - 18.02.2021
    
    I tried this test drive and it wasn't bad. It wasn't too heavy at the front, too light at the rear, and it was a bit like riding in a large group in the aero tunnel. In my opinion, the speed of the leader should be indicated on the Magnet bar. Then it doesn't matter FTP or w/kg or bike and we are clear what the ride will be like. For example: the organizer sets 30 km/h on a flat route and everyone tries to maintain the given speed. With that assumption, you don't even need a new feature. But yes, chat would come in handy.

jplampin - 15.02.2021

Tried the beta test group ride today and really enjoyed it. But how do we know which group rides will be suitable for our ability ? Are you going to run different ones based on W/KG or FTP?

williep - 16.02.2021

Not an answer to your question, but how did you create a group ride? Or did you join a ride? Thx
- ROUVY - 16.02.2021
  
  Hi! Only ROUVY can create a Group ride right now in BETA. You can only join the Group ride if you will find some. :)
  - arnostlobel - 17.02.2021
    
    Two questions:
    
    #1) If it's only the ROUVY team who can create a group ride for now, why was the feature already released as part of the official 1.4.0 update? I got excited when I read the release notes only to find later here that it cannot in fact be used yet.
    
    #2) Will my participation in a group ride count against mandatory rides of challenges and level requirements (assuming I ride at 100% reality). If not, I am afraid I will be able to enjoy the new feature, for there is so many challenges to complete that I have barely time for anything else.
    
    arnostlobel - 17.02.2021
    
    It looks like I missed the answer to my second question was already addressed by the original article above: "Only TSS point will count towards Rouvy career". I thereby assume challenge rides will not count either if ridden in a group-ride mode. Oh well.
- jplampin - 16.02.2021
  
  I saw it listed on https://my.rouvy.com/onlinerace so just registered for it. Theres some discussion of this new option on the rouvy athletes facebook group too.

INTRODUCTION OF MULTI-LAP AND GROUP RIDE IN LIMITED BETA MODE

MULTI-LAP

GROUP RIDE

Event characteristics:

-> Goal: Joy of riding and bantering with your training partners!

HOW IT WORKS

MEHR ARTIKEL

WE ARE WORKING ON A NEW WEBSITE

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